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	<title>Comments on: &#8220;You lie!&#8221;: Revisited</title>
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		<title>By: DirtyLib</title>
		<link>http://whateverisright.com/2009/10/you-lie-revisited/comment-page-1/#comment-1114</link>
		<dc:creator>DirtyLib</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Oct 2009 17:32:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://whateverisright.com/?p=3124#comment-1114</guid>
		<description>&quot;It’s a sad day in America when there can’t be sincerely two-sided political debate without resorting to childish mudslinging, rhetorical absurdities, or misleading, truth-bending proclamations.&quot;

In a post about Joe Wilson, you make this plea without a hint of irony? Seriously? Hilarious. And sad. 

Are you aware of a little thing called talk radio? What about Fox News? 24/7 hate-talk that mocks and attacks all non-believers and greatly misinforms its legions of followers. For some reason, I doubt if you really want to see a civil debate, because the right wing would shrivel up from lack of oxygen. The business/propaganda model of the entire right wing media behemoth is based on being salacious, uncivil, uncouth, politically incorrect (i.e. rude and obnoxious), and hard bent. Emotions carry the day. Reason, calm deliberation, rational thought - these are unheard of in right wing circles. It&#039;s trench warfare for the right, against the enemy that really threatens them - the left. Joe Wilson was simply caught up in the furor because he, like his teabagger supporters and defenders - are just SO ANGRY that Obama and the Democrats won the election - really crushed the Republicans - and that they are intent on passing meaningful legislation. Resentment. Fear and loathing. The typical impetus behind various and sundry Republican &quot;movements.&quot;

You fail to mention that Wilson is a big supporter of the confederate flag and the confederacy in general, and found it &quot;unseemly&quot; that Strom Thurmond&#039;s daughter would speak out and tarnish his life&#039;s work of being the nation&#039;s most high-profile racist.

However, I agree that the &quot;You lie!&quot; outburst was not necessarily racist. It was bigoted. You can argue semantics about whether Wilson - and Rush and Sean and Glenn and the entire right-wing army - harbors racist views. But you can&#039;t argue the undercurrent of pure, unadulterated bigotry. Disagree? Sing a few lines of &quot;Barack the Magic Negro&quot; to your closest minority friends (GUFFAW) and see if they think it is bigoted.

Of course, I live in Georgia and we have restaurants selling tee shirts of Obama as Curious George and saying that Obama is going to n*****-rig the healthcare system. We have swastikas spray painted on the signage at the offices of our black congressmen. And Glenn Beck is just convinced that Obama hates white people and white culture. So don&#039;t fool yourself into thinking that there aren&#039;t many racists  in  America, because they are everywhere, and they are almost ALL right-wing nuts. 

However, racist though they may be, right wingers like Joe Wilson are generally more bigoted than racist, inasmuch as they throw the most vile invective at their political adversaries at the FIRST CHANCE. Anyone remember the Iraq war and all the anti-American liberals that were rooting for Saddam Hussein? 

Here&#039;s Joe Wilson getting hysterical and shouting and falsely calling someone a liar in 2002 (from the WaPo):

&quot;Filner, who opposes unilateral U.S. military action, suggested that in the 1980s, when U.S. officials sided with Iraq in its war against Iran, Saddam Hussein obtained biological and chemical weapons technology from the United States. &#039;We gave it to him,&#039; Filner asserted.

    &quot;&#039;That is wrong. That’s made up,&#039; Wilson fired back. &#039;I can’t believe you would say something like that.&#039;

    &quot;When Filner calmly held his ground, advising Wilson to read newspaper reports and other documentation, the Republican erupted: &#039;This hatred of America by some people is just outrageous. And you need to get over that.&#039;

    &quot;As moderator Connie Brod sat by helplessly, Filner challenged: &#039;Hatred of America? … Are you accusing me?&#039;

    &quot;&#039;Yes!&#039; Wilson shouted. For good measure, over the next minute Wilson accused Filner of harboring &#039;hatred of America&#039; four more times, of being &#039;hateful&#039; three times and of being &#039;viscerally anti-American&#039; once.&quot;

I haven&#039;t even mentioned the fact that the premise of your posting is flawed and in and of itself bigoted. You go to great lengths and tie yourself up in knots in your attempt to defend Wilson and imply that Obama is a liar. Your strongest indictment:

&quot;...according to the [CRS]: &#039;It would appear that unauthorized aliens who meet the substantial presence test would be required under H.R. 3200 to have health insurance.&#039; That is straight from the mouth of the government bureaucracy itself, folks. Illegals, just like you and me, will fall under ObamaCare’s mandated universal health care coverage (i.e. government tax) plan.&quot;

You couldn&#039;t misinterpret this more if you tried. You are conflating different issues. The CRS summary states that it would APPEAR that illegal immigrants would be MANDATED to purchase health insurance. On the other hand, section 246 CLEARLY STATES that it would be AGAINST THE LAW for the federal government to subsidize BENEFITS (affordability credits) for illegals. Eligibility and mandates to purchase health insurance is a separate subject from forbidding federal assistance going to illegals.

Hence, Obama was accurate and precise, as he usually is. Unlike you and your buddy Joe Wilson, the knuckle dragger bigot who demeaned himself in front of the nation. 

If you need further clarification regarding your (deliberate?) misrepresentation of the bill, then you&#039;re just too dense or ideologically bent to see the facts dispassionately.

Not to mention that this particular house bill that you are misrepresenting is only one of, what, five bills that have passed committee and are now being hammered together. i.e. the bill is essentially a draft, anyhow. 

Schmuck.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;It’s a sad day in America when there can’t be sincerely two-sided political debate without resorting to childish mudslinging, rhetorical absurdities, or misleading, truth-bending proclamations.&#8221;</p>
<p>In a post about Joe Wilson, you make this plea without a hint of irony? Seriously? Hilarious. And sad. </p>
<p>Are you aware of a little thing called talk radio? What about Fox News? 24/7 hate-talk that mocks and attacks all non-believers and greatly misinforms its legions of followers. For some reason, I doubt if you really want to see a civil debate, because the right wing would shrivel up from lack of oxygen. The business/propaganda model of the entire right wing media behemoth is based on being salacious, uncivil, uncouth, politically incorrect (i.e. rude and obnoxious), and hard bent. Emotions carry the day. Reason, calm deliberation, rational thought &#8211; these are unheard of in right wing circles. It&#8217;s trench warfare for the right, against the enemy that really threatens them &#8211; the left. Joe Wilson was simply caught up in the furor because he, like his teabagger supporters and defenders &#8211; are just SO ANGRY that Obama and the Democrats won the election &#8211; really crushed the Republicans &#8211; and that they are intent on passing meaningful legislation. Resentment. Fear and loathing. The typical impetus behind various and sundry Republican &#8220;movements.&#8221;</p>
<p>You fail to mention that Wilson is a big supporter of the confederate flag and the confederacy in general, and found it &#8220;unseemly&#8221; that Strom Thurmond&#8217;s daughter would speak out and tarnish his life&#8217;s work of being the nation&#8217;s most high-profile racist.</p>
<p>However, I agree that the &#8220;You lie!&#8221; outburst was not necessarily racist. It was bigoted. You can argue semantics about whether Wilson &#8211; and Rush and Sean and Glenn and the entire right-wing army &#8211; harbors racist views. But you can&#8217;t argue the undercurrent of pure, unadulterated bigotry. Disagree? Sing a few lines of &#8220;Barack the Magic Negro&#8221; to your closest minority friends (GUFFAW) and see if they think it is bigoted.</p>
<p>Of course, I live in Georgia and we have restaurants selling tee shirts of Obama as Curious George and saying that Obama is going to n*****-rig the healthcare system. We have swastikas spray painted on the signage at the offices of our black congressmen. And Glenn Beck is just convinced that Obama hates white people and white culture. So don&#8217;t fool yourself into thinking that there aren&#8217;t many racists  in  America, because they are everywhere, and they are almost ALL right-wing nuts. </p>
<p>However, racist though they may be, right wingers like Joe Wilson are generally more bigoted than racist, inasmuch as they throw the most vile invective at their political adversaries at the FIRST CHANCE. Anyone remember the Iraq war and all the anti-American liberals that were rooting for Saddam Hussein? </p>
<p>Here&#8217;s Joe Wilson getting hysterical and shouting and falsely calling someone a liar in 2002 (from the WaPo):</p>
<p>&#8220;Filner, who opposes unilateral U.S. military action, suggested that in the 1980s, when U.S. officials sided with Iraq in its war against Iran, Saddam Hussein obtained biological and chemical weapons technology from the United States. &#8216;We gave it to him,&#8217; Filner asserted.</p>
<p>    &#8220;&#8216;That is wrong. That’s made up,&#8217; Wilson fired back. &#8216;I can’t believe you would say something like that.&#8217;</p>
<p>    &#8220;When Filner calmly held his ground, advising Wilson to read newspaper reports and other documentation, the Republican erupted: &#8216;This hatred of America by some people is just outrageous. And you need to get over that.&#8217;</p>
<p>    &#8220;As moderator Connie Brod sat by helplessly, Filner challenged: &#8216;Hatred of America? … Are you accusing me?&#8217;</p>
<p>    &#8220;&#8216;Yes!&#8217; Wilson shouted. For good measure, over the next minute Wilson accused Filner of harboring &#8216;hatred of America&#8217; four more times, of being &#8216;hateful&#8217; three times and of being &#8216;viscerally anti-American&#8217; once.&#8221;</p>
<p>I haven&#8217;t even mentioned the fact that the premise of your posting is flawed and in and of itself bigoted. You go to great lengths and tie yourself up in knots in your attempt to defend Wilson and imply that Obama is a liar. Your strongest indictment:</p>
<p>&#8220;&#8230;according to the [CRS]: &#8216;It would appear that unauthorized aliens who meet the substantial presence test would be required under H.R. 3200 to have health insurance.&#8217; That is straight from the mouth of the government bureaucracy itself, folks. Illegals, just like you and me, will fall under ObamaCare’s mandated universal health care coverage (i.e. government tax) plan.&#8221;</p>
<p>You couldn&#8217;t misinterpret this more if you tried. You are conflating different issues. The CRS summary states that it would APPEAR that illegal immigrants would be MANDATED to purchase health insurance. On the other hand, section 246 CLEARLY STATES that it would be AGAINST THE LAW for the federal government to subsidize BENEFITS (affordability credits) for illegals. Eligibility and mandates to purchase health insurance is a separate subject from forbidding federal assistance going to illegals.</p>
<p>Hence, Obama was accurate and precise, as he usually is. Unlike you and your buddy Joe Wilson, the knuckle dragger bigot who demeaned himself in front of the nation. </p>
<p>If you need further clarification regarding your (deliberate?) misrepresentation of the bill, then you&#8217;re just too dense or ideologically bent to see the facts dispassionately.</p>
<p>Not to mention that this particular house bill that you are misrepresenting is only one of, what, five bills that have passed committee and are now being hammered together. i.e. the bill is essentially a draft, anyhow. </p>
<p>Schmuck.</p>
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